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EU Withdrawal Negotiations

 

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Part-Timer
Chelsea Transfer Target

May 2, 2019, 9:07 AM

Posts: 4410
Location: Huntingdonshire
Team(s): Brentford, Bradford City, Peterborough United, Yaxley

Post #3526 of 3810 (1594 views)
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Re: [leohoenig] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
Incidentally, how many people thought the Liberal Democrats, SNP or "Tiggers" were Brexit parties?

Liberal Democrats: 5%
SNP: 3%
"Tiggers": 13%


Part-Timer
Chelsea Transfer Target

May 2, 2019, 9:10 AM

Posts: 4410
Location: Huntingdonshire
Team(s): Brentford, Bradford City, Peterborough United, Yaxley

Post #3527 of 3810 (1591 views)
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Re: [Yatesman] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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In Reply To
Oh Lord, just when you thought it couldn’t get worse, the Defence Secretary has been sacked for leaking official secrets.


I haven't seen the news on this but the next question has to be 'Will charges follow?'

The most brutal sacking letter from a PM that I have ever seen. Williamson denies it. Are cabinet ministers covered by employment legislation (and if not, why not)? A claim for unfair dismissal would be tremendously entertaining.


PaulC
Man City Transfer Target!


May 9, 2019, 10:57 AM

Posts: 11236
Location: Ayrshire, Midlothian
Team(s): AFC Darwen, Troon, Ayr Utd, Burnley

Post #3528 of 3810 (1221 views)
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Re: [Part-Timer] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

"A no-deal Brexit would be nothing compared to the sacrifice made in WW2 to ensure Britain's freedom"
Anne Widdecombe, Brexit Party.

Sounds good, this no-deal Brexit. Not as bad as WWII.

But whatever happened to Brexit's sunlit uplands?


Towlawtom
Reserve Team Regular


May 9, 2019, 12:34 PM

Posts: 581
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Post #3529 of 3810 (1190 views)
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Re: [PaulC] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
"A no-deal Brexit would be nothing compared to the sacrifice made in WW2 to ensure Britain's freedom"
Anne Widdecombe, Brexit Party.

Sounds good, this no-deal Brexit. Not as bad as WWII.

But whatever happened to Brexit's sunlit uplands?


The WW2/Brexit crap is one of the most depressing aspects of this shitshow. I'm particularly unimpressed with the "We fought..." thing, as if the wankers who repeat it have ever made even the tiniest sacrifice. The WW2 generation voted to join the EU project in 75.



I need to have the last word, as it always looks as if I am right !


Ronsdog
First Team Star


May 9, 2019, 3:00 PM

Posts: 2537
Location: Sarf London
Team(s): Lowestoft Town, Crystal Palace

Post #3530 of 3810 (1139 views)
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Re: [Towlawtom] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
"A no-deal Brexit would be nothing compared to the sacrifice made in WW2 to ensure Britain's freedom"
Anne Widdecombe, Brexit Party.

Sounds good, this no-deal Brexit. Not as bad as WWII.

But whatever happened to Brexit's sunlit uplands?


The WW2/Brexit crap is one of the most depressing aspects of this shitshow. I'm particularly unimpressed with the "We fought..." thing, as if the wankers who repeat it have ever made even the tiniest sacrifice. The WW2 generation voted to join the EU project in 75.


......and many, not of that generation, that voted to remain in the EEC in 1975, have changed their minds. That's democracy in action.

As Peter Shore and Tony Benn pointed out at the time the EEC will morph into a political project.....and what a 'shitshow' it has become.
Bankrupt Southern States thanks to the Euro and delusions of becoming a United States of Europe with its own army and foreign policy that's its members will be expected to adhere to.

The U.K. by voting to leave is simply leading the way.

I'm expecting voters Europe wide to follow our brave lead by voting in their droves on May 23rd for anti EU parties to rid themselves of the corrupting influence of this anti democratic and dangerous political project.

The whole project is a busted flush.


(This post was edited by Ronsdog on May 9, 2019, 3:04 PM)


PaulC
Man City Transfer Target!


May 9, 2019, 3:10 PM

Posts: 11236
Location: Ayrshire, Midlothian
Team(s): AFC Darwen, Troon, Ayr Utd, Burnley

Post #3531 of 3810 (1127 views)
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Re: [Ronsdog] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
......and many, not of that generation, that voted to remain in the EEC in 1975, have changed their minds. That's democracy in action.


And since 2016 many who voted to Leave have changed their minds again.

That's why the second referendum will be democracy in action too.

https://whatukthinks.org/...ow-would-you-vote-2/


Ronsdog
First Team Star


May 9, 2019, 4:07 PM

Posts: 2537
Location: Sarf London
Team(s): Lowestoft Town, Crystal Palace

Post #3532 of 3810 (1095 views)
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Re: [PaulC] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
......and many, not of that generation, that voted to remain in the EEC in 1975, have changed their minds. That's democracy in action.


And since 2016 many who voted to Leave have changed their minds again.

That's why the second referendum will be democracy in action too.

https://whatukthinks.org/...ow-would-you-vote-2/


Well that old chestnut rears its head again.

Let's enact the decision of the 2016 referendum first and then after a period of time, maybe 40 years or so, if the EU still exists, then perhaps we can consider another referendum.Tongue


PaulC
Man City Transfer Target!


May 9, 2019, 5:51 PM

Posts: 11236
Location: Ayrshire, Midlothian
Team(s): AFC Darwen, Troon, Ayr Utd, Burnley

Post #3533 of 3810 (1042 views)
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Re: [Ronsdog] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

Well that old chestnut rears its head again.

Let's enact the decision of the 2016 referendum first and then after a period of time, maybe 40 years or so, if the EU still exists, then perhaps we can consider another referendum.Tongue


Dear passengers, we realise you have spotted the iceberg dead ahead, but despite your protestations we will wait till we've hit it before we change course.


Ronsdog
First Team Star


May 9, 2019, 8:57 PM

Posts: 2537
Location: Sarf London
Team(s): Lowestoft Town, Crystal Palace

Post #3534 of 3810 (997 views)
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Re: [PaulC] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

Well that old chestnut rears its head again.

Let's enact the decision of the 2016 referendum first and then after a period of time, maybe 40 years or so, if the EU still exists, then perhaps we can consider another referendum.Tongue


Dear passengers, we realise you have spotted the iceberg dead ahead, but despite your protestations we will wait till we've hit it before we change course.


Your analogy is spot on Paul......except you've mistaken our leaving for the iceberg when its the Euro which will sink the ship!


jon b
First Team Star

May 9, 2019, 10:36 PM

Posts: 2864
Location: Dronfield
Team(s): SUFC, SWFC etc

Post #3535 of 3810 (957 views)
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Re: [Ronsdog] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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a United States of Europe with its own army and foreign policy .


That non existent Euro fantasy army again. Part of the Brexit Project Fear.

The disunited rival European states of the first half of the 20th century had lots of real armies and just about all of them experienced military defeat and the close up and personal joys of occupation by their enemies.

Maybe a democratic union of European states is better than the alternative?

.


PaulC
Man City Transfer Target!


May 9, 2019, 10:38 PM

Posts: 11236
Location: Ayrshire, Midlothian
Team(s): AFC Darwen, Troon, Ayr Utd, Burnley

Post #3536 of 3810 (952 views)
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Re: [Ronsdog] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

23/5/16 £1 =1.294 EUR

9/5/19 £1 = 1.115 EUR

-14%


hawkwind
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May 9, 2019, 11:57 PM

Posts: 1944
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Post #3537 of 3810 (920 views)
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Re: [PaulC] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Before the upcoming European elections perhaps it might be useful to have a bit of information about how the MEPs have voted during the past five years.

Try this questionnaire first which asks how you would vote on a number of issues. At the end you'll get a closest match to individual MEPs and political parties for the whole of Europe with search options allowing you to check against individual countries, etc. Thus you can see which MEPs have most closely represented your views during the last five years.

Also on the same site have fun seeing how the political parties voted as a whole, and individual MEPs voted (when they attended). You can select by country, named MEP, etc.


PaulC
Man City Transfer Target!


May 10, 2019, 8:31 AM

Posts: 11236
Location: Ayrshire, Midlothian
Team(s): AFC Darwen, Troon, Ayr Utd, Burnley

Post #3538 of 3810 (836 views)
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Re: [hawkwind] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Very interesting.

Within the EU I am closest to the the German Social Democrats and Luxembourg Socialist Workers Party.

Within the UK, Plaid Cymru and Greens.


Towlawtom
Reserve Team Regular


May 10, 2019, 9:00 AM

Posts: 581
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Post #3539 of 3810 (820 views)
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Re: [Ronsdog] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
?



......and many, not of that generation, that voted to remain in the EEC in 1975, have changed their minds. That's democracy in action.

As Peter Shore and Tony Benn pointed out at the time the EEC will morph into a political project.....and what a 'shitshow' it has become.
Bankrupt Southern States thanks to the Euro and delusions of becoming a United States of Europe with its own army and foreign policy that's its members will be expected to adhere to.

The U.K. by voting to leave is simply leading the way.

I'm expecting voters Europe wide to follow our brave lead by voting in their droves on May 23rd for anti EU parties to rid themselves of the corrupting influence of this anti democratic and dangerous political project.

The whole project is a busted flush.


I didn't think people were allowed to change their minds!
ShockedShockedShocked



I need to have the last word, as it always looks as if I am right !


Matty
Reserve Team Star

May 10, 2019, 9:11 AM

Posts: 840
Location: Derbyshire
Team(s): All things Derbyshire

Post #3540 of 3810 (816 views)
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Re: [jon b] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
a United States of Europe with its own army and foreign policy .


That non existent Euro fantasy army again. Part of the Brexit Project Fear.

The disunited rival European states of the first half of the 20th century had lots of real armies and just about all of them experienced military defeat and the close up and personal joys of occupation by their enemies.

Maybe a democratic union of European states is better than the alternative?

.

I have seen many direct quotes indicating strongly,that an EU army is an aim, a few weeks back they put 13 million euros to integrating defence, this will also come with unforced contributions from members states, and this whilst most not meeting NATO obligations


jon b
First Team Star

May 10, 2019, 2:35 PM

Posts: 2864
Location: Dronfield
Team(s): SUFC, SWFC etc

Post #3541 of 3810 (744 views)
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Re: [Matty] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
a United States of Europe with its own army and foreign policy .


That non existent Euro fantasy army again. Part of the Brexit Project Fear.

The disunited rival European states of the first half of the 20th century had lots of real armies and just about all of them experienced military defeat and the close up and personal joys of occupation by their enemies.

Maybe a democratic union of European states is better than the alternative?

.

I have seen many direct quotes indicating strongly,that an EU army is an aim, a few weeks back they put 13 million euros to integrating defence, this will also come with unforced contributions from members states, and this whilst most not meeting NATO obligations


I would have put the likelihood of us ever accepting EU military bases on UK territory as zilch. Why on earth would we? In the same way, why would the likes of France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Netherlands etc etc accept EU forces on their territory?

The only circumstance I'd anticipate a member state allowing non national forces to be based on their territory would be to help them deal with an external threat.

In the same way that we already have Non UK military forces based in the UK, namely US personnel and equipment, primarily US Air force. Thereby emphasising which of our two nations is a world power and which no longer is.

Ironically, if the EU ever did have its own military force drawn from across the Union, no doubt they"d communicate with each other in English.

.


(This post was edited by jon b on May 10, 2019, 2:42 PM)


Yatesman
First Team Sub

May 10, 2019, 5:12 PM

Posts: 1176
Location: A Wee Toon in the Scottish Borders
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Post #3542 of 3810 (680 views)
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Re: [jon b] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
a United States of Europe with its own army and foreign policy .


That non existent Euro fantasy army again. Part of the Brexit Project Fear.

The disunited rival European states of the first half of the 20th century had lots of real armies and just about all of them experienced military defeat and the close up and personal joys of occupation by their enemies.

Maybe a democratic union of European states is better than the alternative?

.

I have seen many direct quotes indicating strongly,that an EU army is an aim, a few weeks back they put 13 million euros to integrating defence, this will also come with unforced contributions from members states, and this whilst most not meeting NATO obligations


I would have put the likelihood of us ever accepting EU military bases on UK territory as zilch. Why on earth would we? In the same way, why would the likes of France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Netherlands etc etc accept EU forces on their territory?

The only circumstance I'd anticipate a member state allowing non national forces to be based on their territory would be to help them deal with an external threat.

In the same way that we already have Non UK military forces based in the UK, namely US personnel and equipment, primarily US Air force. Thereby emphasising which of our two nations is a world power and which no longer is.

Ironically, if the EU ever did have its own military force drawn from across the Union, no doubt they"d communicate with each other in English.

.


If the EU told us they wanted an EU army base in the grounds of Buckingham Palace the UK govt would build it in a flash.
We are so compliant with EU rules and directives, however damaging to our nation it is embarrassing.
The only way to be sure of no EU army with UK troops fighting EU wars in Ukraine or Libya is to Leave the EU.
While we're about it....and after the contempt in which they have been shown to hold the UK nation, Let's pull our troops out of the Baltic states and let them face the Russians as they would dare.....without UK 'interference '.
That will be fun to watch!


jon b
First Team Star

May 10, 2019, 5:26 PM

Posts: 2864
Location: Dronfield
Team(s): SUFC, SWFC etc

Post #3543 of 3810 (658 views)
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Re: [Yatesman] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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If the EU told us they wanted an EU army base in the grounds of Buckingham Palace the UK govt would build it in a flash.


Crazy

.


Yatesman
First Team Sub

May 10, 2019, 5:39 PM

Posts: 1176
Location: A Wee Toon in the Scottish Borders
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Post #3544 of 3810 (636 views)
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Re: [jon b] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

If the EU told us they wanted an EU army base in the grounds of Buckingham Palace the UK govt would build it in a flash.


Crazy

.


Clever, witty, intelligent response.......NOT!

Suggests you accept the point I make!


leohoenig
Administrator

May 10, 2019, 5:49 PM

Posts: 13191
Location: Outer Cheltenhamshire
Team(s): Cheltenham Town

Post #3545 of 3810 (614 views)
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Re: [hawkwind] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
Before the upcoming European elections perhaps it might be useful to have a bit of information about how the MEPs have voted during the past five years.

Try this questionnaire first which asks how you would vote on a number of issues. At the end you'll get a closest match to individual MEPs and political parties for the whole of Europe with search options allowing you to check against individual countries, etc. Thus you can see which MEPs have most closely represented your views during the last five years.

Also on the same site have fun seeing how the political parties voted as a whole, and individual MEPs voted (when they attended). You can select by country, named MEP, etc.


In a piece of shock news, the party I generally vote for comes closest to expressing my views (at around 70%)



Fat AND Pompous.
The proof that you can have too much of a good thing
Now blogging at http://www.leohoenig.com



jon b
First Team Star

May 11, 2019, 7:00 AM

Posts: 2864
Location: Dronfield
Team(s): SUFC, SWFC etc

Post #3546 of 3810 (481 views)
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Re: [Yatesman] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To

If the EU told us they wanted an EU army base in the grounds of Buckingham Palace the UK govt would build it in a flash.


Crazy

.



Clever, witty, intelligent response.......NOT!

Suggests you accept the point I make!


The idea that we would ever accept non UK forces on UK territory against the wishes of the UK Government is nonsense.

The idea that we would ever contribute UK forces to an overseas mission against the wishes of the UK Government is also nonsense.

The scare story about the ever so frightening non existent EU army is just more Brexiter Project Fear drivel.

.


Ronsdog
First Team Star


May 11, 2019, 1:03 PM

Posts: 2537
Location: Sarf London
Team(s): Lowestoft Town, Crystal Palace

Post #3547 of 3810 (412 views)
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Re: [jon b] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

The idea that we would ever accept non UK forces on UK territory against the wishes of the UK Government is nonsense.

The idea that we would ever contribute UK forces to an overseas mission against the wishes of the UK Government is also nonsense.

The scare story about the ever so frightening non existent EU army is just more Brexiter Project Fear drivel.

.


I'm surprised that you as a Lib Dem supporter trust our Government to act in the best interests of its citizens.....our current shambles of a government is intending to invite the Chinese to contribute to the nations infrastructure FFS.

The opposition is no better, a ragbag of Marxists that has destroyed the social democrat party that Labour once was.

Furthermore the Tories can't or won't enact the biggest mandate ever given to a ruling party to leave the EU.

My faith in our democracy is being tested to the limit currently and I see little point in voting when my wishes are ignored.


jon b
First Team Star

May 11, 2019, 5:05 PM

Posts: 2864
Location: Dronfield
Team(s): SUFC, SWFC etc

Post #3548 of 3810 (382 views)
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Re: [Ronsdog] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Interesting point.

I suppose I'm trusting that despite the current shambles there is still enough common sense around that a UK Government would not put at risk the defence of the realm. However, as you say, Mrs May seems prepared to allow the Chinese to have involvement in 5G. And as for Jezza….

Strange times.

Maybe a strong showing for the Brexit party in the Euro Elections will scare the 2 main parties into agreeing a relatively soft exit from the EU and we can end the nightmare.

As for the Lib Dems, Vince should have stuck to Strictly. Unsure At least there's a couple of potential leaders emerging and we might do a little better than UKIP and the Tiggers on 23rd May. Crazy

.


Richard Rundle
Man City Transfer Target!

May 11, 2019, 6:27 PM

Posts: 8287
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Post #3549 of 3810 (348 views)
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Re: [jon b] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

So the Change UK leader Heidi Allen was not allowed to appear on Have I Got News For You last night as it might have breached impartiality guidelines ahead of the EU elections. Yet Nigel Farage was allowed to be on Question Time the night before, and is on the Marr show tomorrow. How's that fair and impartial?


Mr. T
Chelsea Transfer Target


May 11, 2019, 6:52 PM

Posts: 5303
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Post #3550 of 3810 (334 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] EU Withdrawal Negotiations [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Under BBC editorial policy guidelines, programmes are expected to ensure parties are given proportionate coverage over an appropriate period of time. A statement from the BBC read: "The BBC has specific editorial guidelines that apply during election periods.

"Because of this it would be inappropriate to feature political party leaders on entertainment programmes during this short election period, which does not allow for equal representation to be achieved."

The broadcaster said it would look to air the episode at a later date.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48235812

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