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NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy

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aiwa
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May 28, 2012, 4:42 PM

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NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy	Can't Post or Reply Privately

Would anyone care to speculate as to whether or not the FA's proposed changes to Steps 1-4 of the National League System for 2013/14 will require significant amendments to the qualifying stages of the FA Cup and FA Trophy? I'm thinking in terms of Step 4 clubs possibly having to enter at an even earlier round.

Richard Rundle
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May 28, 2012, 6:15 PM

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Re: [aiwa] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

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Why would they? It's only 2 more club in each division of the Isthman League isn't it?

hawkwind
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May 28, 2012, 7:40 PM

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Re: [aiwa] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

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FA Cup

Current
EP 400
P 132 + 200 quals
1Q 66 + 166 quals
2Q 44 + 116 quals
3Q 80 quals
4Q 24 + 40 quals
1 48 + 32 quals
2 40 quals
3 44 + 20 quals
758 MAX

from 2013-14 unchanged exemptions
EP 368
P 136 + 184 quals
1Q 72 + 160 quals
2Q 44 + 116 quals
3Q 80 quals
4Q 24 + 40 quals
1 48 + 32 quals
2 40 quals
3 44 + 20 quals
736 MAX

from 2013-14 Step 4 enter 1 round earlier
EP 640 (incl 136 Step 4)
P 320 quals
872 MAX

FAT
Current
P 132 (24 byes)
1Q 66 + 78 quals
2Q 72 quals
3Q 44 + 36 quals
1 24 + 40 quals

from 2013-14
P 136 (8 byes)
1Q 72 + 72 quals
2Q 72 quals
3Q 44 + 36 quals
1 24 + 40 quals

aiwa
Reserve Team Sub

May 28, 2012, 7:52 PM

Posts: 452
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Post #4 of 31 (3818 views)
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Re: [hawkwind] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

In Reply To

FA Cup

Current
EP 400
P 132 + 200 quals
1Q 66 + 166 quals
2Q 44 + 116 quals
3Q 80 quals
4Q 24 + 40 quals
1 48 + 32 quals
2 40 quals
3 44 + 20 quals
758 MAX

from 2013-14 unchanged exemptions
EP 368
P 136 + 184 quals
1Q 72 + 160 quals
2Q 44 + 116 quals
3Q 80 quals
4Q 24 + 40 quals
1 48 + 32 quals
2 40 quals
3 44 + 20 quals
736 MAX

from 2013-14 Step 4 enter 1 round earlier
EP 640 (incl 136 Step 4)
P 320 quals
872 MAX

FAT
Current
P 132 (24 byes)
1Q 66 + 78 quals
2Q 72 quals
3Q 44 + 36 quals
1 24 + 40 quals

from 2013-14
P 136 (8 byes)
1Q 72 + 72 quals
2Q 72 quals
3Q 44 + 36 quals
1 24 + 40 quals

Thanks very much for the maths! If I've understood correctly, the FA Cup 2013/14 would potentially have to lose 22 clubs (presumably from steps 5 and 6) unless it asks some Step 4 clubs to start at the EP? That's a significant change in my book.

aiwa
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May 28, 2012, 7:58 PM

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Post #5 of 31 (3816 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

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Why would they? It's only 2 more club in each division of the Isthman League isn't it?

As Hawkwind's figures show, the extra six clubs at step 3 as well at four more at step 4 have quite an effect on the Cup. I would say that the effect on the Trophy is neither here nor there.

VP
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May 28, 2012, 9:48 PM

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Post #6 of 31 (3791 views)
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Re: [aiwa] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

It doesn't mention rounds but the FAs announcement last year regarding FA Cup eligibility shows there'll be less clubs in it in the future anyway. Starting this coming season....

Clubs below Step 1-5 in The FA National League System must have a ground grade which conforms to a �G� grade (appropriate to Step 6) or higher as at 31 March and Clubs will be allowed three Seasons before the minimum grade is raised to �F� grade (appropriate to Step 5).

(This post was edited by VP on May 28, 2012, 9:49 PM)

KnowYourMarket
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May 30, 2012, 11:45 AM

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Post #7 of 31 (3598 views)
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Re: [VP] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

We need more teams not less. Vive la France.

Grounds: 1151. Last New Ground: St Francis Xavier School, Liverpool. Games since 0-0: 212

UKPunk
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May 30, 2012, 1:43 PM

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Post #8 of 31 (3562 views)
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Re: [KnowYourMarket] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

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We need more teams not less. Vive la France.

Nick, how many clubs entered this year competition?

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Essex Olympian League Premier Division
Frenford Senior 1 Westhamians 0

KnowYourMarket
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May 30, 2012, 3:35 PM

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Post #9 of 31 (3545 views)
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Re: [UKPunk] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

Over 7000

Grounds: 1151. Last New Ground: St Francis Xavier School, Liverpool. Games since 0-0: 212

leohoenig
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May 30, 2012, 4:43 PM

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Post #10 of 31 (3524 views)
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Re: [KnowYourMarket] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

Only 7422 in the 2011-12 Coupe de France, down from the record 7449 of the previous year
http://www.fff.fr/...ance-fete-sa-rentree

Fat AND Pompous.
I was going to list all my grounds for the season, but the moderator said five lines only.
Now blogging at www.leohoenig.com

VP
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May 30, 2012, 7:54 PM

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Post #11 of 31 (3485 views)
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Re: [leohoenig] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

If there were that many entries in England does anyone know what level it'd go down to?
The FA says we have about 30000 adult, male 11 a-side teams but does that include Sunday sides?

UKPunk
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May 30, 2012, 7:56 PM

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Post #12 of 31 (3483 views)
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Re: [leohoenig] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

That's the way it should be done over here as well. Bloody elitist FA! Mad

Matches: 603 (59)
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Last Match: Tuesday 21st May
Essex Olympian League Premier Division
Frenford Senior 1 Westhamians 0

Matty
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May 31, 2012, 10:06 AM

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Post #13 of 31 (3413 views)
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Re: [UKPunk] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

At the bare minimum all Step 6 teams, I'd have at least all step 7 sides as a reward for the hoops they have to jump through for grounding grading (in the N Mids and North anyway)

Richard Rundle
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May 31, 2012, 10:28 AM

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Post #14 of 31 (3406 views)
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Re: [VP] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

In Reply To

If there were that many entries in England does anyone know what level it'd go down to?
The FA says we have about 30000 adult, male 11 a-side teams but does that include Sunday sides?

Yes, plus it also includes reserves and lower teams too.

I've got just over 7100 different clubs on my records for the current season, this is a little too high as where club have "Colts" sides playing in leagues I've included them a seperate club entries for my own data purposes. It's down about 200 from last season.

UKPunk
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May 31, 2012, 10:31 AM

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Post #15 of 31 (3404 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

In Reply To

If there were that many entries in England does anyone know what level it'd go down to?
The FA says we have about 30000 adult, male 11 a-side teams but does that include Sunday sides?

Yes, plus it also includes reserves and lower teams too.

I've got just over 7100 different clubs on my records for the current season, this is a little too high as where club have "Colts" sides playing in leagues I've included them a seperate club entries for my own data purposes. It's down about 200 from last season.

I didn't realise that. I assumed it was just first teams.

AMENDMENT
Do it like the french but with first teams only.

Matches: 603 (59)
Grounds: 279 (51)

Last Match: Tuesday 21st May
Essex Olympian League Premier Division
Frenford Senior 1 Westhamians 0

VP
Man City Transfer Target!

May 31, 2012, 7:27 PM

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Post #16 of 31 (3320 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

In Reply To

If there were that many entries in England does anyone know what level it'd go down to?
The FA says we have about 30000 adult, male 11 a-side teams but does that include Sunday sides?

Is that just 'pyramid' clubs?
Do you include eg. the AFA clubs in your records and other leagues that don't feature on http://en.wikipedia.org/...otball_league_system ?

I know that page says around the 7000 mark in the system but I can't be bothered to add them up and check.

Thinking about it, that will also include plenty of reserve and lower teams.

(This post was edited by VP on May 31, 2012, 7:32 PM)

Richard Rundle
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Jun 1, 2012, 12:37 PM

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Re: [VP] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

No, not just pyramid clubs - all senior Saturday 11-a-side clubs. From the Premier League to the lowest divisions of local leagues. I can provide a full list if anyone is interested

London Harrier
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Jun 9, 2012, 7:13 PM

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Post #18 of 31 (2854 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

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No, not just pyramid clubs - all senior Saturday 11-a-side clubs. From the Premier League to the lowest divisions of local leagues. I can provide a full list if anyone is interested

What is the qualifying criteria for the French cup then?

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A.G.Ricer
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Jun 13, 2012, 8:44 AM

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Re: [London Harrier] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

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No, not just pyramid clubs - all senior Saturday 11-a-side clubs. From the Premier League to the lowest divisions of local leagues. I can provide a full list if anyone is interested

What is the qualifying criteria for the French cup then?

The only criteria is being able to pay the 52 euro entry fee.

yorkieexile
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Jun 13, 2012, 10:09 AM

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Post #20 of 31 (2592 views)
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Re: [A.G.Ricer] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

What is the qualifying criteria for the French cup then?

The only criteria is being able to pay the 52 euro entry fee.

Nothing about being French then?

A.G.Ricer
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Jun 13, 2012, 10:54 AM

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Post #21 of 31 (2574 views)
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Re: [yorkieexile] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

In Reply To

What is the qualifying criteria for the French cup then?

The only criteria is being able to pay the 52 euro entry fee.

Nothing about being French then?

No.
Nothing to do with it.
Apparently they will even let clubs from Brittany take part and Brittany has never considered itself part of France.
As for New Caledonia, Reunion and Guadeloupe........
About time a team from The Falkland Islands was allowed to enter The FA Cup.

Mister TwoU
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Jun 14, 2012, 3:13 PM

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Post #22 of 31 (2428 views)
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Re: [A.G.Ricer] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or

About time a team from The Falkland Islands was allowed to enter The FA Cup.

With all the Argentine aggro going on atm and the Falklanders' referendum about to put one in the eye for Cristina Fern�ndez de Kirchner (expected 100% turn-out, expected 99+% result in favour of remaining British), getting a Falklands team into the Cup would simply be the icing-on-the-cake!

The only slightly more quintessentially British thing the Falklanders could possibly do to disprove Kirchner's claims that they're ambivalent about joining with the South American Republic, would be to get a first-class cricket team into the counties' championship.

Ut temporibus est cum diabolus accipit renes

Still the original Paddy MacNab.

yorkieexile
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Jun 14, 2012, 4:16 PM

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Re: [Mister TwoU] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

Interesting travel arrangements for the away side. Would hope not postponed due to a spot of rain!

Chris1963
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Jun 14, 2012, 4:48 PM

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Post #24 of 31 (2402 views)
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Re: [Mister TwoU] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

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About time a team from The Falkland Islands was allowed to enter The FA Cup.

When the Falklands war was taking place I recall reading in the Guardian a quote from a young boy who said "Why don't they give each side one half each?" The journalist thought this was a good suggestion, and I'm inclined to agree. Why then has no-one ever mentioned partition? I do not know if Argentina would accept just West Falkland on condition that they renounced all claims to the eastern half, but I think it is worth trying. The current impasse cannot continue and we have better things to spend money on than the army presence there. Of course, there are a few Falklanders living in the western half, but any deal could let them remain there, or be given compensation and new houses on the eastern island.

Richard Rundle
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Jun 15, 2012, 9:53 AM

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Re: [Chris1963] NLS Changes for 2013/14 and Cup/Trophy [In reply to]	Can't Post or Reply Privately

There isn't an "impaase", there is a stable situation of a British overseas territory wishing to remain British.

If the French laid claim to the Channel Islands would you give them Guernsey to renounce a claim on Jersey?

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