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Home: Non-League Football Discussion: General Discussion:
Best Non Pyramid League in London?

 

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darney
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Oct 1, 2010, 1:52 PM

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Post #176 of 787 (33912 views)
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Re: [kenningwellfc] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

That may be so however the junior cup matches are over 3 weeks old now and the intermediate results are up on the site which took place after the junior cup first batch of games?? In addition I have spoken with the guy who deals with the results at the FA and he says that he has given all the results to the person who actually updates the website, so where are those results they are still not up as of today? I have actually trawled as many of the individual leagues as i can to get these results and there can olny be about 4/5 results that I haven't managed to get so the excuse that they haven't got "all the results" is a bit weak, they should have been up several weeks ago.


kenningwellfc
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Oct 1, 2010, 7:36 PM

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Post #177 of 787 (33881 views)
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Re: [darney] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I see.

Well just in case you didn't get this Junior Cup Result, Greenhouse Bethwin beat Kenningwell United Reserves 5 - 2!


kenningwellfc
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Oct 2, 2010, 6:15 PM

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Post #178 of 787 (33851 views)
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Re: [kenningwellfc] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
If any of you are looking for an LFA Sunday Challenge Cup game this Sunday then my own team, Kenningwell United are at home to Groundhoppers, 10.30 kick off at our new home ground - Southwark Sports Ground (Peckham Town FC), 37 Dulwich Common, SE21 7EU.

Entry is free but we do charge 2 for a copy of our programme, which is normally around 30 pages long. Tea and coffee is also available pre and post match.



Mishi
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Oct 2, 2010, 11:42 PM

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Post #179 of 787 (33829 views)
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Re: [kenningwellfc] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

What time is the game being called off at? There's no way Southwark Sports will beat this rain...



Grounds visited: 745
Last new ground:Horsham FC; The Camping World Community Stadium, Horsham, West Sussex. (Isthmian League Premier Division)
Last game: Saturday 21st September 2019: Dulwich Hamlet 6, Bognor Regis Town 1. [ FA Cup 2nd qualifying round]
Matches watched this season: 46
2017/18-New English grounds: 7 & foreign: 0




kenningwellfc
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Oct 3, 2010, 8:24 AM

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Post #180 of 787 (33819 views)
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Re: [Mishi] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Sorry the game is OFF. That was what my last message was for but some of it was missed off at the end!


Mishi
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Oct 3, 2010, 9:14 AM

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Post #181 of 787 (33811 views)
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Re: [kenningwellfc] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Not surprised! I'm sure not much anywhere will play today, but Southwark Sports has never drained well down the years.

I must get to one of your games one morning? Why? To be honest, one chap was showing off your programme at a game I happened to be at a couple of years ago, it looks very good! You're local & your 'perseistent nagging/plugging' on here deserves 'rewarding'! ;-)



Grounds visited: 745
Last new ground:Horsham FC; The Camping World Community Stadium, Horsham, West Sussex. (Isthmian League Premier Division)
Last game: Saturday 21st September 2019: Dulwich Hamlet 6, Bognor Regis Town 1. [ FA Cup 2nd qualifying round]
Matches watched this season: 46
2017/18-New English grounds: 7 & foreign: 0




Isaac
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Oct 3, 2010, 9:17 AM

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Post #182 of 787 (33811 views)
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Re: [kenningwellfc] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Thanks for confirming that, I guessed it would be with the heavy rain


kenningwellfc
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Oct 3, 2010, 10:57 AM

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Post #183 of 787 (33800 views)
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Re: [Isaac] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Mishi, I am sure we would be honoured if you were to grace us with your presence! ;-)

We always produce a programme for our home games so obviously we are really pleased when we receive feedback.

I will post details of the re-arranged fixture by Monday evening at the latest.


stevegraze
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Oct 3, 2010, 5:51 PM

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Post #184 of 787 (33775 views)
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Re: [Isaac] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

New Salamis -v- London Maccabi Lions should be a very good game. Two teams from very good leagues, and New Salamis are the holders of course.

Any idea why Clapton could not fulfill their fixture? Have they folded?


darney
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Oct 3, 2010, 6:54 PM

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Post #185 of 787 (33766 views)
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Re: [stevegraze] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I see Baldon lost in the Senior cup anybody see that game?


stevegraze
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Oct 4, 2010, 3:39 AM

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Post #186 of 787 (33739 views)
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Re: [darney] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Baldon losing is a big shock. They lost to Rizokarpasso - from the KOPA League. The same league as New Salamis who have beaten Baldon in 2 of the last 3 Challenge Cup finals. Well, at least Baldon still have the FA NATIONAL Sunday Cup to play for.

Interesting, it seems that Clapton Rangers' first team has withdrawn from the Hackney and Leyton League. They lost their three best players (Michael Filletti, Nathan Scarborough and James Smith) to another team in the same league. Real shame. I wonder what will happen to their ambitions of becoming a fully semi-pro SATURDAY team.
That said, their reserves are still in the East London Sunday League.


kenningwellfc
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Oct 6, 2010, 9:39 AM

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Post #187 of 787 (33658 views)
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Re: [stevegraze] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

For anyone wishing to attend, the re-arranged Sunday Challenge Cup tie between Kenningwell United and Groundhoppers is now taking place this Sunday, 2pm kick off at Southwark Sports. Full address and map is available on www.kenningwellfc.com


darney
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Oct 11, 2010, 3:14 PM

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Post #188 of 787 (33553 views)
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Re: [kenningwellfc] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

As we are Involved in a London cup tie shortly was wondering if anyone knew how strong the Turkish Community football Federation league (i.e. Not the KOPA league)is as we are playing the side that currently tops the Second Division Gaziantepspor?. They have walloped the sides that have played so far in the league but only won 3-2 in the first round of the london junior cup, does anyone have any useful info on them?


HughesVideo
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Oct 11, 2010, 4:24 PM

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Post #189 of 787 (33535 views)
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Re: [darney] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Some interesting results here in the LFA Sunday Challenge Cup yesterday.
New Salamis 7 London Maccabi Lions 2 ! Shocked

The Maccabi Sunday League Premier Division Table is very interesting with London Maccabi Lions bottom and North West Neasden only just above them ! Both of them go in the F.A. National Sunday Cup and the LFA Sunday Challenge Cup, while the two teams currently first and second (Redbridge Jewish Care and Faithfold) both go in the LFA Sunday Intermediate Cup !
Faithfold are playing Enfield Royals (from the Waltham Sunday League) on the 24th October and it looks as is Enfield Royals are going to have their work cut out winning that one, as they have had a poor start to the season in our Premier Division...which is extremely strong this year.

Enfield Rangers are playing London Maccabi Lions this Sunday in the National Sunday Cup, so I would hope that Rangers can get through.

Continental did our League proud on Sunday by beating Panthea on penalties. Sounds like it was the good close game I predicted ?

As for the Turkish Community Football Federation, the normal 'big two' Akincilar and Yavruvatan have both lost once already, so I wouldn't be surprised if that League is getting even stronger. The current leaders in the top Division, Yalova, were a force in London F.A. Cups a few years ago, but I have never heard of BJK Kizilirmak, who currently lie in second place. I would think that Gaziantepspor will be a tough team to beat.



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darney
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Oct 11, 2010, 6:34 PM

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Post #190 of 787 (33516 views)
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Re: [HughesVideo] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Thanks Hughsie my instincts are also telling me that Gaizantespor will be a tough test even though I can get no other info on them other than their league results so far for this season and that they drew with Yalova 3-3 in a turkish cup match only a couple of weeks ago. Seeing that Yalova reached the London Junior semi's last year (the same as us) I know they are of a level. Really difficult trying to prepare for this game without knowing much about the opposition and never having seen them play but I would still take us to go through as we are also a tough team to beat in the cups.

I noticed that Enfield Royals Reserves lost 8-0 in the first round of the junior cup (one of the few ties that I actually predicted wrong!) as I thought they would be a side that progressed further they must be a lot weaker than last year?!


HughesVideo
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Oct 11, 2010, 7:30 PM

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Post #191 of 787 (33506 views)
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Re: [darney] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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I noticed that Enfield Royals Reserves lost 8-0 in the first round of the junior cup (one of the few ties that I actually predicted wrong!) as I thought they would be a side that progressed further they must be a lot weaker than last year?!


I don't know what's going on with Enfield Royals this season. Their First Team (who are now in the Premier Division) have lost all three of their matches played so far and I think they failed to fulfil another fixture (although there may be a dispute of some sort with that one), while their Reserves have lost 5 out of 5.

Maybe they have lost a few first teamers through work & family commitments and injuries and the Reserve Team players stepping up to the Premier are not good enough for that level ? If that's the case, I sympathise, as that is what happened to us about 8 years ago.
We ran one team, got into the Premier Division and finished joint-second, so the following season we decided to start a Reserve Team to phase older players out and give some promising youngsters a game in a lower Division. Of course as soon as we did that, a lot of quality First Team players left because of work & family stuff and the Reserve players were not good enough for the Premier Division. The First Team then ended up getting relegated and we have been stuck in Division One ever since. The biggest mistake we made though was not putting the Reserve Team in the bottom Division, as they ended up losing every single game the following season and we had to fold them up because the players were demoralised.

Running a Reserve Team in Sunday football is very, very difficult nowadays, and I am amazed how the likes of Baldon Sports and Eltham Town manage to do it...in fact they even run more than two teams.



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darney
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Oct 11, 2010, 8:19 PM

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Post #192 of 787 (33495 views)
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Re: [HughesVideo] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Yes I think Eltham Town have about 4 or even 5 teams within themselves and have been around a very, very long time there is in fact more than ONE Eltham town FC around also, so its difficult to know sometimes which Eltham Town FC people are referring to! they must be run very well and Baldon also have several sides and well run (although I saw their reserve game get abandoned yesterday as they were on the pitch next to my team - they were losing at the time).

My team started a reserve side this year which is mainly players and a manager from another club and new players that responded to an ad they compete in the bottom division of our league but so far they have lost 5 out of 5 (league and cup) and I think the demorilisation is setting in already! At the moment I can't see them getting a positive result even in the bottom league, sometimes the players just aint good enough to be honest.


HughesVideo
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Oct 11, 2010, 9:30 PM

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Post #193 of 787 (33485 views)
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Re: [darney] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


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My team started a reserve side this year which is mainly players and a manager from another club and new players that responded to an ad they compete in the bottom division of our league but so far they have lost 5 out of 5 (league and cup) and I think the demorilisation is setting in already! At the moment I can't see them getting a positive result even in the bottom league, sometimes the players just aint good enough to be honest.


The problem I found with running a Sunday League Reserve Team is that a lot of the players who answer ads to play at that level have never actually played competitive 11-a-side football before ! It's because it's been phased out in schools over the last 10-15 years and in Youth Football it's Mini-Soccer up until the age of 11. A lot of kids then just have kickabout matches with their mates after that or play 5-a-side/7-a-side at Powerleague, then they come to us to play 11-a-side competitively at 18 and haven't got a clue about positional sense, movement off the ball, calling and tactics. They then lose heavily even in the bottom Division because of that, even though most of the players have got plenty of skill and tricks.



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The_Player
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Oct 12, 2010, 11:18 AM

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Post #194 of 787 (33449 views)
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Re: [HughesVideo] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I think what you'll find with the Maccabi Sunday Football League is that there is currently a shift in power. The teams that historically have always been good in the league e.g. London Maccabi Lions and North West Neasden are losing players to Saturday to football. However, these teams all have players that they can call upon for big matches if they want to. However, it seems they didn't call enough of the big game players back for the game against New Salamis.

Where as Redbridge Jewish Care is a newly formed team and probably entered the intermediate cup so they could get used to playing county cup football, I'm sure next season they'll be in the London Challenge cup, also Faithfold haven't had a strong team for a while which is why they've probably chose to play in the intermediate cup instead of the challenge cup.

To be honest when teams are in London leagues they join any cup that they feel like, but I get your point, why are the 2 bottom teams in the Challenge cup and the 2 top teams in the intermediate cup? But it could be just the way the early season fixtures have panned out.

On another note, a team I mentioned earlier from the Hendon & District Sunday Football League, NLO (North London Olympians) they have now moved their best team to the Harrow & District Sunday Football League this season (which is a very competitive league) and they have entered both the Middlesex Premier Cup and the London Challenge Cup, so it will be interesting to see how well they do in both competitions as they are a very good side.

North London Olympians also beat Albion Manor, from the Hackney & Leyton Sunday Football League, 5-0 on Sunday which shows how strong NLO are given the perceived strength of the Hackney & Leyton league. I think NLO could definately be the team to watch in the elite county cups. I'm not sure if there has ever been a team that has won both the London & Middlesex cups in the same season, although that would be a very difficult task achieve.



http://www.intertracafc.co.uk - Playing in the Barnet Sunday Football League



stevegraze
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Oct 14, 2010, 12:49 AM

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Post #195 of 787 (33388 views)
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Re: [The_Player] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

NLO beat Albion Manor 5-0?! Bl**dy hell. That's a shocking result...especially as Albion Manor won their first three league games this season, including beating the seemingly invincible Hackney and Leyton League champs Lapton - who have won 8 (yes EIGHT) league titles in a row since they were formed. I will definitely be keeping an eye on NLO.

Darney - if you are playing any team from the top Div of the Turkish league, expect a tough game. That league is a very high standard. A few years back, they and the KOPA (Cypriot) League used to monopolise victories in the the London county cups.

Hughesvideo, teams like Baldon Sports, Eltham Town, and Clapton Rangers can maintain reserve teams because they win all the time! It is very easy to attract 25+ guys to your club when you can tell them "we've been in London cup finals for the last three years" (Baldon and Clapton), and your players are local heroes to young kids. When you have "Sunday" teams picking most of their players from semi-pro Saturday football (including Baldon who have Conference players and internationals in their team!), the Reserve squad might be the only way for "regular" Sunday league players with no semi-pro ambitions to get game time.
They usually put their Reserves in a different league.

There's definitely been a shift in Sunday league football power this season: Baldon, Enfield Royals, North West Neasden A, London Maccabi Lions, Lapton all starting slowly, and Clapton Rangers withdrawing their first team entirely.


(This post was edited by stevegraze on Oct 14, 2010, 12:51 AM)


darney
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Oct 14, 2010, 7:48 AM

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Post #196 of 787 (33366 views)
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Re: [stevegraze] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Thanks Steve but the team we are playing are top of the Turkish Second Division although they did draw in the cup with a team in the top Turkish division recently that's why it is so difficult to assess how strong they REALLY are without seeing them play. Anyways as Hughesy said I am taking it that they will be a strong side and am expecting a difficult game especially as we have to travel early on the sunday morning to get to their place!


HughesVideo
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Oct 14, 2010, 10:16 AM

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Re: [stevegraze] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
Hughesvideo, teams like Baldon Sports, Eltham Town, and Clapton Rangers can maintain reserve teams because they win all the time!

That's very true Steve.

We haven't won anything or even reached a Cup Final for 23 years now (which was when we joined the Waltham Sunday League), and there are four other clubs in our League (Northmet Riverside, Northaw, White Hart & Chase Side Old Boys) who all ran Reserve Teams while they were in the Premier Division and then had to fold them up because too many players got fed up with losing. Those four clubs (who have all been running even longer than we have !) are now running just one team in the lower Divisions and it's amazing that they manage to keep going, especially Chase Side Old Boys, who are now bottom of the bottom Division. They have been advertising for new players over the last couple of seasons, and I hear that virtually all of those who answer are not good enough to get into other teams in the League and are just desperate for a game with 'whoever'. More and more of their better players then leave and it's a downward spiral which is very difficult to stop unless you are lucky enough to find a whole new group of committed players from a successful Youth set-up and get back up the divisions with a winning side. Chase Side Youth are a very successful set-up in the North London area, but it seems they don't feed their Under-18 players en-bloc into their Old Boys side for some reason.

You usually find that good quality Saturday players will play Sunday League football with their mates first and foremost, but invariably their mates are fellow current or ex-Semi-Pros who are playing for a successful Sunday side who consistently win trophies. If a Semi-Pro standard Saturday player is new to the area and is looking for a club, he will always look for a trophy-winning one ahead of a well-run club like ourselves who never win anything. We had a Spartan South Midlands player trial for us in a Pre-Season Friendly in August which we lost 6-1. He left straight away and joined a regular trophy-winning team in the Premier Division instead, albeit a very well-run one who also have a very successful Reserve side.



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(This post was edited by HughesVideo on Oct 14, 2010, 10:17 AM)


stevegraze
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Oct 14, 2010, 1:55 PM

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Post #198 of 787 (33333 views)
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Re: [HughesVideo] Best Non Pyramid League in London? [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

Hughesvideo - great comments about the mentality of good players. "Trophy hunting" is a rife phenomenon in Sunday league football. Good Saturday league players rarely ever join mid-table Sunday teams. They always join top Sunday Premier Clubs where they KNOW they will win trophies with other semi-pro players. e.g. in the last few years Premier teams in the Hackney and Leyton League like Lapton, Clapton Rangers, Bancroft Utd and Eureka have constantly poached players from each other. When players don't get in the first 11, they just join another Prem team. They'd never think of dropping down to a lower Div team because they think it is "beneath" them.

The only way they will go to a lower Div is if they move to another league/Div as a group - so they are still playing with their semi-pro mates. After going through 2 seasons unbeaten with 100% records (in lower Divs), the league tried in vain to make Lapton move up several Divisions - but Lapton refused. They liked smashing teams in lower leagues by double digits. I recall reading a hilarious match report by one of their opponents who had lost 1-9 or so. They said playing Lapton was akin to "getting the most royal dicking since Charles slipped it to Camilla"! Sly

But "special" clubs like Baldon, Clapton etc will always get enough good players to run a successful reserve team because of their great reputation. I mean we have been debating on this forum since last year talking about their great successes! When you win London County Cups every year, it is not hard to convince people to play for you - reserves or not. Over the past few years, Baldon's firsts AND reserves have been winning trophies. In fact some of these teams have reserve teams so good that they put them in a different league in order to avoid having their 1st and 2nd teams ending up in the same Div!

I think youth teams are the way to go. That way you can bring a successful group of young players together into the first team, without having to put up with the idignity of guys who have only played playground football.


stevegraze
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Oct 16, 2010, 4:47 PM

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Clapton Rangers [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I just heard that the reason they withdrew their first team is because they lost funding. In previous seasons, they got funding because the majority of the team were loyal lads from the Clapton estate. Now that they have become a "big" club and attract their players from all over the place, their sponsors withdrew funding as they are no longer considered a "local community" club.

That said, their Reserves are still playing in the East London Sunday Football League. Wonder what happened to all their first team players?


darney
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Oct 17, 2010, 5:39 PM

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Re: [stevegraze] Clapton Rangers [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I see that The Lounge beat Baldon in the sunday FA CUP it seems the lounge are a very strong side top of the Morden and District league as well with a 100% record.

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