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Home: Non-League Football Discussion: Restructuring Discussion:
Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet

 

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petermiller36
First Team Sub

Sep 8, 2018, 12:57 PM

Posts: 1112
Location: Nottingham
Team(s): Ware & AFC Wimbledon

Post #1 of 28 (12767 views)
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Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet Can't Post or Reply Privately

Hello all. I've gone about creating this season's promotion and relegation document that I've done for the past seven season. I started the first one in 2011/2012 to show the bottleneck between steps 4 and 5 but now due to the FA seemingly determined to rely on reprieves and PPG to decide club fortunes, I feel like I've had to extend how far the spreadsheet goes. There's SO much knowledge on these forums, more than I have, so if anyone would like to wade through and point out errors or changes then that would be appreciated.

http://bit.ly/PPG1819



Steps 4-7 Relegation and Promotion document:
http://bit.ly/PPG1819


windydcfc
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 8, 2018, 2:32 PM

Posts: 10465
Location: Barnetby
Team(s): Derby County FC England Borussia Mönchengladbach

Post #2 of 28 (12718 views)
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Re: [petermiller36] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

The SWPL are allowed to turn down promotion to step 5. Phil Hiscox has said that it is highly unlikely that any teams will want to accept promotion. This opens up potentially 2 more step 6 runners up to be promoted. I think you need to somehow show this in the spreadsheet.



Non League Projection - 2020/21: https://docs.google.com/...UTgVhKYTo/edit#gid=0
Step 1: https://www.google.com/....119447550000018&z=7
Step 2: https://www.google.com/...677250654298405&z=15
Step 3: https://www.google.com/...358611350589399&z=16
Step 4: https://www.google.com/...536616305542566&z=16
Step 5: https://www.google.com/...399355140531952&z=16
Step 6: https://www.google.com/...1556307438963813&z=9


keneastlancs
Reserve Team Regular

Sep 8, 2018, 7:35 PM

Posts: 566
Location: Darwen Lancashire
Team(s): all non league - especially north western teams

Post #3 of 28 (12579 views)
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Re: [petermiller36] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

What happens if reserves sides win step 7 leagues next year I know in the northern based leagues they cant go into step 6 -I ask because currently Hebburn resevers lead Wearside league and Altrincham reserves lead Cheshire league. will the 2nd places teams be classed as the promotion hopefuls?


windydcfc
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 8, 2018, 8:16 PM

Posts: 10465
Location: Barnetby
Team(s): Derby County FC England Borussia Mönchengladbach

Post #4 of 28 (12539 views)
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Re: [keneastlancs] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
What happens if reserves sides win step 7 leagues next year I know in the northern based leagues they cant go into step 6 -I ask because currently Hebburn resevers lead Wearside league and Altrincham reserves lead Cheshire league. will the 2nd places teams be classed as the promotion hopefuls?



The FA standardised rules, overrule local league rules. Which allows Reserves to play at step 6. The EBAC NL have already had Reserves playing in their league. Hebburn Reserves will be applying for promotion, if the first team are also promoted.



Non League Projection - 2020/21: https://docs.google.com/...UTgVhKYTo/edit#gid=0
Step 1: https://www.google.com/....119447550000018&z=7
Step 2: https://www.google.com/...677250654298405&z=15
Step 3: https://www.google.com/...358611350589399&z=16
Step 4: https://www.google.com/...536616305542566&z=16
Step 5: https://www.google.com/...399355140531952&z=16
Step 6: https://www.google.com/...1556307438963813&z=9


(This post was edited by windydcfc on Sep 8, 2018, 8:18 PM)


keneastlancs
Reserve Team Regular

Sep 8, 2018, 8:46 PM

Posts: 566
Location: Darwen Lancashire
Team(s): all non league - especially north western teams

Post #5 of 28 (12506 views)
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Re: [windydcfc] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

but the NWCL never have had reserve teams in and as far as I know are totally against the inclusion but that would be the league that Altrincham reserves would go to.


petermiller36
First Team Sub

Sep 8, 2018, 9:13 PM

Posts: 1112
Location: Nottingham
Team(s): Ware & AFC Wimbledon

Post #6 of 28 (12474 views)
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Re: [windydcfc] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
The SWPL are allowed to turn down promotion to step 5. Phil Hiscox has said that it is highly unlikely that any teams will want to accept promotion. This opens up potentially 2 more step 6 runners up to be promoted. I think you need to somehow show this in the spreadsheet.


Thanks Windy. I've added a note to show that.



Steps 4-7 Relegation and Promotion document:
http://bit.ly/PPG1819


Richard Rundle
Man City Transfer Target!

Sep 8, 2018, 9:29 PM

Posts: 8469
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Post #7 of 28 (12458 views)
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Re: [windydcfc] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
[
The FA standardised rules, overrule local league rules. Which allows Reserves to play at step 6. The EBAC NL have already had Reserves playing in their league


That was over 30 years ago, long before Ebac had anything to do with the Northern League.


windydcfc
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 9, 2018, 6:17 AM

Posts: 10465
Location: Barnetby
Team(s): Derby County FC England Borussia Mönchengladbach

Post #8 of 28 (12294 views)
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Re: [keneastlancs] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
but the NWCL never have had reserve teams in and as far as I know are totally against the inclusion but that would be the league that Altrincham reserves would go to.



The FA’s standardised rules are very specific & as I said they overrule local league rules. The UCL had to accept St Neots Saints, a few years back, this was against their rules & wishes. This would be the same for any league at step 6.



Non League Projection - 2020/21: https://docs.google.com/...UTgVhKYTo/edit#gid=0
Step 1: https://www.google.com/....119447550000018&z=7
Step 2: https://www.google.com/...677250654298405&z=15
Step 3: https://www.google.com/...358611350589399&z=16
Step 4: https://www.google.com/...536616305542566&z=16
Step 5: https://www.google.com/...399355140531952&z=16
Step 6: https://www.google.com/...1556307438963813&z=9


windydcfc
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 9, 2018, 6:19 AM

Posts: 10465
Location: Barnetby
Team(s): Derby County FC England Borussia Mönchengladbach

Post #9 of 28 (12293 views)
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Re: [Richard Rundle] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
[
The FA standardised rules, overrule local league rules. Which allows Reserves to play at step 6. The EBAC NL have already had Reserves playing in their league


That was over 30 years ago, long before Ebac had anything to do with the Northern League.



You are correct that EBAC weren’t sponsoring the NL. But the facts are still the same & the standardised rules are very clear.



Non League Projection - 2020/21: https://docs.google.com/...UTgVhKYTo/edit#gid=0
Step 1: https://www.google.com/....119447550000018&z=7
Step 2: https://www.google.com/...677250654298405&z=15
Step 3: https://www.google.com/...358611350589399&z=16
Step 4: https://www.google.com/...536616305542566&z=16
Step 5: https://www.google.com/...399355140531952&z=16
Step 6: https://www.google.com/...1556307438963813&z=9


Sale Holmfield
First Team Regular

Sep 9, 2018, 10:25 AM

Posts: 1394
Location: Sale
Team(s): Altrincham, Conwy Borough

Post #10 of 28 (12175 views)
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Re: [keneastlancs] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
but the NWCL never have had reserve teams in and as far as I know are totally against the inclusion but that would be the league that Altrincham reserves would go to.

In practice, I don't think this will be an issue as I haven't heard any of desire for promotion, and the reserves don't usually play at Moss Lane, but at Egerton in Knutsford which falls short on ground grading rules.


windydcfc
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 9, 2018, 11:35 AM

Posts: 10465
Location: Barnetby
Team(s): Derby County FC England Borussia Mönchengladbach

Post #11 of 28 (12121 views)
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Re: [Sale Holmfield] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
but the NWCL never have had reserve teams in and as far as I know are totally against the inclusion but that would be the league that Altrincham reserves would go to.

In practice, I don't think this will be an issue as I haven't heard any of desire for promotion, and the reserves don't usually play at Moss Lane, but at Egerton in Knutsford which falls short on ground grading rules.



I’m sure if Altrincham wants to develop their Reserves more, then they will make sure they play all their home games at Moss Lane. But as you mentioned, they may not have any desire for promotion. This isn’t the case with Hebburn though & both first & reserve teams will have to win their specific leagues.



Non League Projection - 2020/21: https://docs.google.com/...UTgVhKYTo/edit#gid=0
Step 1: https://www.google.com/....119447550000018&z=7
Step 2: https://www.google.com/...677250654298405&z=15
Step 3: https://www.google.com/...358611350589399&z=16
Step 4: https://www.google.com/...536616305542566&z=16
Step 5: https://www.google.com/...399355140531952&z=16
Step 6: https://www.google.com/...1556307438963813&z=9


(This post was edited by windydcfc on Sep 9, 2018, 11:45 AM)


Tim
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 9, 2018, 11:39 AM

Posts: 8282
Location: Stourbridge, Charmouth
Team(s): Stourbridge, Welton Rovers

Post #12 of 28 (12114 views)
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Re: [windydcfc] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I thought promotion was compulsory from Step 7 now...


shimtoan
First Team Regular


Sep 9, 2018, 12:48 PM

Posts: 1366
Location: Dunkirk, Nottingham
Team(s): Dunkirk

Post #13 of 28 (12058 views)
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Re: [windydcfc] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
but the NWCL never have had reserve teams in and as far as I know are totally against the inclusion but that would be the league that Altrincham reserves would go to.



The FA’s standardised rules are very specific & as I said they overrule local league rules. The UCL had to accept St Neots Saints, a few years back, this was against their rules & wishes. This would be the same for any league at step 6.

sorry to be that guy, but why is it only ever the Northern League that is referred to on here using it's sponsored name? Surely it should be all or none?



unless stated, all views are my own and are not the views of any other person, club, or organisation


windydcfc
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 10, 2018, 11:09 AM

Posts: 10465
Location: Barnetby
Team(s): Derby County FC England Borussia Mönchengladbach

Post #14 of 28 (11601 views)
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Re: [petermiller36] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
The SWPL are allowed to turn down promotion to step 5. Phil Hiscox has said that it is highly unlikely that any teams will want to accept promotion. This opens up potentially 2 more step 6 runners up to be promoted. I think you need to somehow show this in the spreadsheet.


Thanks Windy. I've added a note to show that.



The biggest unknown, is the relegation from league's that are running with less than they should. This will obviously effect the promotion from the steps below. i.e. The Hellenic Prem is running with 19 clubs & the Northern League is running with 18 clubs. The standardised rules state that the bottom 2 will be relegated. I contacted the FA & asked if this would still be the case in these 2 league's. Their reply was 'it's down to the league committee's discretion'. Obviously this leave's 3 options open: no relegations(from the NL), 1 club relegated from both league's(which is what I think will happen) or 2 teams relegated from both league's(they'll just promote more step 6 runners up, which the LC preferred to do last season. aka Stafford Town being relegated).



Non League Projection - 2020/21: https://docs.google.com/...UTgVhKYTo/edit#gid=0
Step 1: https://www.google.com/....119447550000018&z=7
Step 2: https://www.google.com/...677250654298405&z=15
Step 3: https://www.google.com/...358611350589399&z=16
Step 4: https://www.google.com/...536616305542566&z=16
Step 5: https://www.google.com/...399355140531952&z=16
Step 6: https://www.google.com/...1556307438963813&z=9


Armchair Libero
Youth Team Sub


Sep 10, 2018, 1:13 PM

Posts: 139
Location: Worcester
Team(s): Wigan Athletic, Atherton Collieries

Post #15 of 28 (11499 views)
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Re: [petermiller36] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

this spreadsheet is exquisite, I would take it out to dinner and introduce it to my parents if I could.


petermiller36
First Team Sub

Sep 10, 2018, 9:48 PM

Posts: 1112
Location: Nottingham
Team(s): Ware & AFC Wimbledon

Post #16 of 28 (11220 views)
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Re: [windydcfc] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
The biggest unknown, is the relegation from league's that are running with less than they should. This will obviously effect the promotion from the steps below. i.e. The Hellenic Prem is running with 19 clubs & the Northern League is running with 18 clubs. The standardised rules state that the bottom 2 will be relegated. I contacted the FA & asked if this would still be the case in these 2 league's. Their reply was 'it's down to the league committee's discretion'. Obviously this leave's 3 options open: no relegations(from the NL), 1 club relegated from both league's(which is what I think will happen) or 2 teams relegated from both league's(they'll just promote more step 6 runners up, which the LC preferred to do last season. aka Stafford Town being relegated).


It's most frustrating that the FA don't clarify these issues, but in their eyes I guess it gives them freedom to make it work how they want. The tighter the regulations and rules, the less freedom they have to do as they please.



Steps 4-7 Relegation and Promotion document:
http://bit.ly/PPG1819


paulh66
Qatar World Cup bid member!


Sep 10, 2018, 9:58 PM

Posts: 19245
Location: Surrey
Team(s): Tranmere Rovers, South Liverpool (the South will rise again), Cammell Laird

Post #17 of 28 (11208 views)
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Re: [petermiller36] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
The biggest unknown, is the relegation from league's that are running with less than they should. This will obviously effect the promotion from the steps below. i.e. The Hellenic Prem is running with 19 clubs & the Northern League is running with 18 clubs. The standardised rules state that the bottom 2 will be relegated. I contacted the FA & asked if this would still be the case in these 2 league's. Their reply was 'it's down to the league committee's discretion'. Obviously this leave's 3 options open: no relegations(from the NL), 1 club relegated from both league's(which is what I think will happen) or 2 teams relegated from both league's(they'll just promote more step 6 runners up, which the LC preferred to do last season. aka Stafford Town being relegated).


It's most frustrating that the FA don't clarify these issues, but in their eyes I guess it gives them freedom to make it work how they want. The tighter the regulations and rules, the less freedom they have to do as they please.


I'd say it's poor, not just frustrating. This surely needs clarifying before the end of the season, even if it's just to say the bottom two (out of 18 teams, say) should still bank on going down, but might get a reprieve.


multilevel
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Sep 10, 2018, 11:25 PM

Posts: 424
Location:
Team(s): King's Lynn Town

Post #18 of 28 (11128 views)
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Re: [paulh66] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
The biggest unknown, is the relegation from league's that are running with less than they should. This will obviously effect the promotion from the steps below. i.e. The Hellenic Prem is running with 19 clubs & the Northern League is running with 18 clubs. The standardised rules state that the bottom 2 will be relegated. I contacted the FA & asked if this would still be the case in these 2 league's. Their reply was 'it's down to the league committee's discretion'. Obviously this leave's 3 options open: no relegations(from the NL), 1 club relegated from both league's(which is what I think will happen) or 2 teams relegated from both league's(they'll just promote more step 6 runners up, which the LC preferred to do last season. aka Stafford Town being relegated).


It's most frustrating that the FA don't clarify these issues, but in their eyes I guess it gives them freedom to make it work how they want. The tighter the regulations and rules, the less freedom they have to do as they please.


I'd say it's poor, not just frustrating. This surely needs clarifying before the end of the season, even if it's just to say the bottom two (out of 18 teams, say) should still bank on going down, but might get a reprieve.

Recently it's been a common theme that the bottom club gets relegated regardless so perhaps they'll take that line with the divisions which aren't full.


windydcfc
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 11, 2018, 7:07 AM

Posts: 10465
Location: Barnetby
Team(s): Derby County FC England Borussia Mönchengladbach

Post #19 of 28 (11057 views)
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Re: [multilevel] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To

In Reply To
The biggest unknown, is the relegation from league's that are running with less than they should. This will obviously effect the promotion from the steps below. i.e. The Hellenic Prem is running with 19 clubs & the Northern League is running with 18 clubs. The standardised rules state that the bottom 2 will be relegated. I contacted the FA & asked if this would still be the case in these 2 league's. Their reply was 'it's down to the league committee's discretion'. Obviously this leave's 3 options open: no relegations(from the NL), 1 club relegated from both league's(which is what I think will happen) or 2 teams relegated from both league's(they'll just promote more step 6 runners up, which the LC preferred to do last season. aka Stafford Town being relegated).


It's most frustrating that the FA don't clarify these issues, but in their eyes I guess it gives them freedom to make it work how they want. The tighter the regulations and rules, the less freedom they have to do as they please.


I'd say it's poor, not just frustrating. This surely needs clarifying before the end of the season, even if it's just to say the bottom two (out of 18 teams, say) should still bank on going down, but might get a reprieve.

Recently it's been a common theme that the bottom club gets relegated regardless so perhaps they'll take that line with the divisions which aren't full.



It's not just at step 5 we have this issue. It's actually worse at step, where the rules state that the bottom 2 in each division will be relegated & replaced with a maximum of 38 step 7 clubs. But some step 6 league's only have 14 clubs & others have 18 or 19. I think there's about 25 spaces available. I agree that they'll probably relegate only a single club from the 2 step 5 league's. But it's not certain, because they may want to promote all the step 6 runners up before they think about reprieving & it does mention this in the standardised rules.



Non League Projection - 2020/21: https://docs.google.com/...UTgVhKYTo/edit#gid=0
Step 1: https://www.google.com/....119447550000018&z=7
Step 2: https://www.google.com/...677250654298405&z=15
Step 3: https://www.google.com/...358611350589399&z=16
Step 4: https://www.google.com/...536616305542566&z=16
Step 5: https://www.google.com/...399355140531952&z=16
Step 6: https://www.google.com/...1556307438963813&z=9


hawkwind
First Team Star

Sep 12, 2018, 12:27 PM

Posts: 1992
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Post #20 of 28 (10574 views)
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Re: [petermiller36] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
Hello all. I've gone about creating this season's promotion and relegation document that I've done for the past seven season. I started the first one in 2011/2012 to show the bottleneck between steps 4 and 5 but now due to the FA seemingly determined to rely on reprieves and PPG to decide club fortunes, I feel like I've had to extend how far the spreadsheet goes. There's SO much knowledge on these forums, more than I have, so if anyone would like to wade through and point out errors or changes then that would be appreciated.

http://bit.ly/PPG1819


As it stands Melksham Town would be a third side that began play-offs with no chance of promotion. Up to eight clubs could theoretically begin play-offs with no chance of going up although I would like to think that the FA wouldn't insist that a division that couldn't supply a promotion club went ahead with three pointless play-off matches.

(This post was edited by hawkwind on Sep 12, 2018, 3:41 PM)


liam_AFCTU
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Sep 12, 2018, 12:39 PM

Posts: 6
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Post #21 of 28 (10557 views)
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Re: [hawkwind] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

What I don't understand is how they could not come up with a better system. Surely relegating the 2 worst place 19th place teams at step 3 making it 14 down which would allow all play off winners to go up would make more sense?


petermiller36
First Team Sub

Sep 12, 2018, 6:59 PM

Posts: 1112
Location: Nottingham
Team(s): Ware & AFC Wimbledon

Post #22 of 28 (10355 views)
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Re: [hawkwind] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To

In Reply To
Hello all. I've gone about creating this season's promotion and relegation document that I've done for the past seven season. I started the first one in 2011/2012 to show the bottleneck between steps 4 and 5 but now due to the FA seemingly determined to rely on reprieves and PPG to decide club fortunes, I feel like I've had to extend how far the spreadsheet goes. There's SO much knowledge on these forums, more than I have, so if anyone would like to wade through and point out errors or changes then that would be appreciated.

http://bit.ly/PPG1819


As it stands Melksham Town would be a third side that began play-offs with no chance of promotion. Up to eight clubs could theoretically begin play-offs with no chance of going up although I would like to think that the FA wouldn't insist that a division that couldn't supply a promotion club went ahead with three pointless play-off matches.


You are correct about Melksham Town, I've now updated it. If I'm honest, I didn't get round to sorting sides by goal difference if they're on the same PPG at the moment.

And yes, having all eight clubs with the lowest PPG in the same two divisions would be a nightmare for the FA I believe. I do wonder if the FA are hoping (but surely not) that two clubs drop down from Step 3 to make this headache/bottleneck go away.



Steps 4-7 Relegation and Promotion document:
http://bit.ly/PPG1819


petermiller36
First Team Sub

Sep 12, 2018, 7:38 PM

Posts: 1112
Location: Nottingham
Team(s): Ware & AFC Wimbledon

Post #23 of 28 (10330 views)
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Re: [petermiller36] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

I've just noticed an error in my own sheet. At Step 3 relegation, I had it down as being clubs reprieved from relegation but it's not. If there are vacancies at Step 3 then the unlucky playoff losers will go up.



Steps 4-7 Relegation and Promotion document:
http://bit.ly/PPG1819


tel
Junior Team Star

Sep 27, 2018, 4:08 PM

Posts: 80
Location: Stanwell
Team(s): Abbey Rangers & Ashford Town Mx

Post #24 of 28 (9411 views)
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Re: [petermiller36] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately

As I watch mainly step 5/6 football now we are a few weeks into the season I am still being asked about promotion to step 5. After telling only the Champions will definitely be promoted and only the 9 runners up with best PPG between the 19 leagues will go with them.

Possibly 10 runners up if the SWP don’t promote.

If league management reiterate this at one of their meetings it could save teams thinking at least top 2 to be promoted

Well done Peter Miller excellent spread sheet


windydcfc
Man City Transfer Target!


Sep 27, 2018, 5:56 PM

Posts: 10465
Location: Barnetby
Team(s): Derby County FC England Borussia Mönchengladbach

Post #25 of 28 (9311 views)
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Re: [tel] Steps 3-7 Spreadsheet [In reply to] Can't Post or Reply Privately


In Reply To
As I watch mainly step 5/6 football now we are a few weeks into the season I am still being asked about promotion to step 5. After telling only the Champions will definitely be promoted and only the 9 runners up with best PPG between the 19 leagues will go with them.

Possibly 10 runners up if the SWP don’t promote.

If league management reiterate this at one of their meetings it could save teams thinking at least top 2 to be promoted

Well done Peter Miller excellent spread sheet



It’s a bit more complicated than how you’ve described it. The FA’s standardised rules state that the 19 champions & 9 best runners up on ppg basis. But beyond this there are 3 spaces at step 5(1 in the Hellenic & 2 in the Northern league’s). The FA have stated that these extra 3 spaces will be determined by the League Committees discretion. The FA’s standardised rules state that the other 10 step 6 runners up will be promoted, before any reprieves are offered to those clubs(on a ppg basis across step 5). The biggest issue is ‘what is defined as a relegation place’ in those two leagues & that won’t be decided until the league committee meets after the end of the season. Also, the top 2 teams in the SWPL could reject promotion(if the runners up are one of the top 9 best ppg basis).



Non League Projection - 2020/21: https://docs.google.com/...UTgVhKYTo/edit#gid=0
Step 1: https://www.google.com/....119447550000018&z=7
Step 2: https://www.google.com/...677250654298405&z=15
Step 3: https://www.google.com/...358611350589399&z=16
Step 4: https://www.google.com/...536616305542566&z=16
Step 5: https://www.google.com/...399355140531952&z=16
Step 6: https://www.google.com/...1556307438963813&z=9


(This post was edited by windydcfc on Sep 27, 2018, 8:01 PM)

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